> Kennedy announced the change in an editorial in The Wall Street Journal, claiming that the “committee has been plagued with persistent conflicts of interest and has become little more than a rubber stamp for any vaccine.”
Presumably to be replaced with political appointees / friends?
All the conflict of interest stuff is just a giant smokescreen. Kennedy is anti-Vaccine, he might sometimes pretend to not be againt vaccines but that is just misdirection. He's going to sow doubt about vaccines, he already removed vaccines from recommendations against all scientific evidence and will make new vaccines (and even adapted versions of existing vaccines) much harder if not impossible to approve.
>> Members of the ACIP are appointed to four-year terms, and many were slated to serve on the committee for another three years. Kennedy wrote Monday that “without removing the current members, the current Trump administration would not have been able to appoint a majority of new members until 2028.”
So, another lawsuit against illegal executive branch dismissal of federal workers, then?
Was this a new committee? there is a quote about this being a coup, but it is also noted that the previous administration selected the entire existing committee
I'm sure Kennedy would like to eliminate vaccinations but this is probably just another purge of independent/nonpartisan/democrat elements of the government. Trump wants only loyalists so he can have total control over the function of the government. More likely we'll see vaccine policy be horsetraded for monetary contributions and pledges to root out DEI.
Everyone in the VC community who helped elect President Trump is partially responsible for each child that suffers and dies from a vaccine-preventable disease due to this action.
i am not a skeptic, but with covid19 vax i first hand witnessed completely irregular menstrual cycles, and nerve issues/trigeminal neuralgia that doctors have been unable to "explain" only occuring after my first jab and continue for years.
i took 2 jabs at that start of covid vaxinations, fcked my life up to be honest.
only now doctors they are saying may be related after years of inconclusive reports..
we jumped the gun on covid19 vax, i am fine with anything being out many many years.
we wouldnt dare give it to our children.
BUT we are upto date and will continue to be upto date on immunizations as required by local health and schools (covid is not one of them).
It was the politicization of vaccines during the latter stages of the COVID pandemic that finally broke my hopes for a positive future in the near term.
I thought that something like a pandemic would have brought us all together around a base truth. However, politics + social media was stronger than R₀, this time.
there is an old principle of debate, that first you should be able to state your opponent's argument in a way that your opponent will not disagree with, and then you argue against what you just stated. Start now, I want to hear that you understand what RFK thinks. Go.
My wife was born in the USSR and this year ended up coming down with HIB (a bacteria initially thought to be the cause of the flu) because it was not part of the inoculation schedule for the USSR and is not universally done. As a woman in her thirties she was sick and mostly bed ridden for two months and has vocal cord damage that may or may not be healed with physical therapy. The whole family picked it up from my son’s preschool where HIB is essentially harmlessly endemic due to inoculations. As a young child or infant, catching a particularly bad HIB strain can cause an infection of the brain and potential death.
Meanwhile my son and I (both inoculated in our first months of life) had a very light cold, essentially unnoticeable on my part, and were ok in a couple days. Because we inoculate children against HIB no doctors sees serious cases like this in otherwise healthy adults and it took many rounds of seeing multiple doctors before they tried looking for HIB. The bacteria is very very common but only the immunocompromised are checked with any regularity.
Incidents like this will become more common if these antivax anti science schemes are in effect for long enough. HIB is not a big flashy name because we have solved this problem. You get a “cold”, are told to rest, and you never remember it happening as time passes. My wife is not going to forget the part of her vocal range that does not work. She has had to stop her singing classes, something she loves.
“You died of dysentery” is a meme in the US because the only people we collectively know who have had dysentery are the characters we played in the Oregon Trail as kids in school. As someone who has had Dysentery care of an outbreak in the Caribbean, I feel like we’re seeing the result of the tremendous success of our health programs allowing completely stupid thinking to gain power.
What really pains me through all this is that the absence of disease does not mean that vaccines do not work! One would think the latest pointless measles outbreak would have been proof to convince people that the antivax rhetoric is all bunk, yet here we are. I don’t understand how we have gotten here beyond people simply not seeing up close what has been prevented by decades of programs.
My parents are old enough to have grown up with people who were irreparably harmed by Polio. The only ones I know of are aging senators or when the odd documentary on iron lungs. The vaccine development for Polio is the example that people like RFK use against all other vaccines, as if they’re all made the same way and as if we had not learned from the experience. Regulations are often written in blood and it’s simply disgraceful that they are throwing away what has been codified so they can smugly sell onesies with “I didn’t get a vaccine” on it.
Meanwhile RFK’s kids are vaccinated.
Charlatan.
If someone thinks they’ve actually been harmed by a vaccine, there’s a part of the government that would like to talk to you. Better do that fast before that gets torn down too.
I’m not a fan of newspapers allowing their platforms to be used by federal officeholders for announcements. RFKJr has a much larger and better platform for this as a high-ranking member of the federal government. There’s no reason for him not to issue a release through the WH for this. Doing it through a paper just feels like the press is in bed with the government (ironically, given the content of this article).
I’m okay with federal officeholders selling ideas in newspapers like Obama did with Obamacare. He didn’t receive special treatment – just another voice in the marketplace of ideas. It’s just the announcement exclusives that feel wrong.
I believe that he promised not to do this during his confirmation hearing. He lied under oath, it would seem. One way or another, RFKJ has a truthfulness problem. You can try to excuse this with "politicians all lie". But that doesn't make him less a liar. Why should we now believe a single thing he says?
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28 Comments
java-man
This is a part of the coordinated attack on the United States.
duxup
> Kennedy announced the change in an editorial in The Wall Street Journal, claiming that the “committee has been plagued with persistent conflicts of interest and has become little more than a rubber stamp for any vaccine.”
Presumably to be replaced with political appointees / friends?
JohnTHaller
Direct link in case the anti-science flagging brigade takes this down: https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/kennedy-guts-acip…
fabian2k
All the conflict of interest stuff is just a giant smokescreen. Kennedy is anti-Vaccine, he might sometimes pretend to not be againt vaccines but that is just misdirection. He's going to sow doubt about vaccines, he already removed vaccines from recommendations against all scientific evidence and will make new vaccines (and even adapted versions of existing vaccines) much harder if not impossible to approve.
mullingitover
> “committee has been plagued with persistent conflicts of interest and has become little more than a rubber stamp for any vaccine.”
Packing the committee with a diverse group of cranks and cronies will surely restore confidence in the health care system.
bstsb
clinical science tends to have a leftist bias towards… being accurate? proven? safe?
pixxel
[dead]
canadiantim
[flagged]
ethbr1
>> Members of the ACIP are appointed to four-year terms, and many were slated to serve on the committee for another three years. Kennedy wrote Monday that “without removing the current members, the current Trump administration would not have been able to appoint a majority of new members until 2028.”
So, another lawsuit against illegal executive branch dismissal of federal workers, then?
dacox
Was this a new committee? there is a quote about this being a coup, but it is also noted that the previous administration selected the entire existing committee
cosmicgadget
I'm sure Kennedy would like to eliminate vaccinations but this is probably just another purge of independent/nonpartisan/democrat elements of the government. Trump wants only loyalists so he can have total control over the function of the government. More likely we'll see vaccine policy be horsetraded for monetary contributions and pledges to root out DEI.
josu
"Although it’s typically not viewed as a partisan board, the Biden administration had installed the entire committee."
m101
[flagged]
gregwebs
[flagged]
JoeDohn
[flagged]
sys13
This is a step back for science in the service of public health – I'm sad for the many children that will die needless deaths
_elf
Everyone in the VC community who helped elect President Trump is partially responsible for each child that suffers and dies from a vaccine-preventable disease due to this action.
sergers
i am not a skeptic, but with covid19 vax i first hand witnessed completely irregular menstrual cycles, and nerve issues/trigeminal neuralgia that doctors have been unable to "explain" only occuring after my first jab and continue for years.
i took 2 jabs at that start of covid vaxinations, fcked my life up to be honest.
only now doctors they are saying may be related after years of inconclusive reports..
we jumped the gun on covid19 vax, i am fine with anything being out many many years.
we wouldnt dare give it to our children.
BUT we are upto date and will continue to be upto date on immunizations as required by local health and schools (covid is not one of them).
so we arent anti-vax.
we anti-letting us and our kids be the test bed.
andreygrehov
[flagged]
tracerbulletx
There is not a single ideologically valid defense for being anti-vaccine. It's just anti humanity, anti science, and anti life.
consumer451
It was the politicization of vaccines during the latter stages of the COVID pandemic that finally broke my hopes for a positive future in the near term.
I thought that something like a pandemic would have brought us all together around a base truth. However, politics + social media was stronger than R₀, this time.
neonate
https://archive.md/IuJ4r
hackernoops
[dead]
fsckboy
there is an old principle of debate, that first you should be able to state your opponent's argument in a way that your opponent will not disagree with, and then you argue against what you just stated. Start now, I want to hear that you understand what RFK thinks. Go.
Moto7451
My wife was born in the USSR and this year ended up coming down with HIB (a bacteria initially thought to be the cause of the flu) because it was not part of the inoculation schedule for the USSR and is not universally done. As a woman in her thirties she was sick and mostly bed ridden for two months and has vocal cord damage that may or may not be healed with physical therapy. The whole family picked it up from my son’s preschool where HIB is essentially harmlessly endemic due to inoculations. As a young child or infant, catching a particularly bad HIB strain can cause an infection of the brain and potential death.
Meanwhile my son and I (both inoculated in our first months of life) had a very light cold, essentially unnoticeable on my part, and were ok in a couple days. Because we inoculate children against HIB no doctors sees serious cases like this in otherwise healthy adults and it took many rounds of seeing multiple doctors before they tried looking for HIB. The bacteria is very very common but only the immunocompromised are checked with any regularity.
Incidents like this will become more common if these antivax anti science schemes are in effect for long enough. HIB is not a big flashy name because we have solved this problem. You get a “cold”, are told to rest, and you never remember it happening as time passes. My wife is not going to forget the part of her vocal range that does not work. She has had to stop her singing classes, something she loves.
“You died of dysentery” is a meme in the US because the only people we collectively know who have had dysentery are the characters we played in the Oregon Trail as kids in school. As someone who has had Dysentery care of an outbreak in the Caribbean, I feel like we’re seeing the result of the tremendous success of our health programs allowing completely stupid thinking to gain power.
What really pains me through all this is that the absence of disease does not mean that vaccines do not work! One would think the latest pointless measles outbreak would have been proof to convince people that the antivax rhetoric is all bunk, yet here we are. I don’t understand how we have gotten here beyond people simply not seeing up close what has been prevented by decades of programs.
My parents are old enough to have grown up with people who were irreparably harmed by Polio. The only ones I know of are aging senators or when the odd documentary on iron lungs. The vaccine development for Polio is the example that people like RFK use against all other vaccines, as if they’re all made the same way and as if we had not learned from the experience. Regulations are often written in blood and it’s simply disgraceful that they are throwing away what has been codified so they can smugly sell onesies with “I didn’t get a vaccine” on it.
Meanwhile RFK’s kids are vaccinated.
Charlatan.
If someone thinks they’ve actually been harmed by a vaccine, there’s a part of the government that would like to talk to you. Better do that fast before that gets torn down too.
jimbob45
I’m not a fan of newspapers allowing their platforms to be used by federal officeholders for announcements. RFKJr has a much larger and better platform for this as a high-ranking member of the federal government. There’s no reason for him not to issue a release through the WH for this. Doing it through a paper just feels like the press is in bed with the government (ironically, given the content of this article).
I’m okay with federal officeholders selling ideas in newspapers like Obama did with Obamacare. He didn’t receive special treatment – just another voice in the marketplace of ideas. It’s just the announcement exclusives that feel wrong.
bediger4000
I believe that he promised not to do this during his confirmation hearing. He lied under oath, it would seem. One way or another, RFKJ has a truthfulness problem. You can try to excuse this with "politicians all lie". But that doesn't make him less a liar. Why should we now believe a single thing he says?
drevil-v2
This is a recording of an ACIP meeting to approve the Hep B vaccine in 2018… say whatever you want but this is not "Science"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=tegyXGiQjsc